Does Kombucha Live Up to the Hype? with Julia Zumpano, RD

Podcast Transcript

John Horton:

Hey there, and welcome to another Health Essentials Podcast. I'm John Horton, your host. Today, we're going to chat about kombucha, a fermented tea drink that dates back 2,000 plus years, but recently just exploded in popularity. Consider this a decade ago, worldwide sales of kombucha barely inched above $500 million. This year, that number is expected to reach $6.5 billion. So, why is this health-branded tea suddenly a must-have? And is it really worth all this attention? When we have questions like that, we reach out to our good friend and registered dietitian, Julia Zumpano. She's one of the many experts at Cleveland Clinic who pop into our weekly podcast to make sense of health trends. So, let's see what she has to say about kombucha. Julia, welcome to the show. I always love talking with you.

Julia Zumpano:

Thank you for having me today.

John Horton:

Now, I suppose being a dietitian, I imagine you have people all the time coming up to you and asking you what they should eat, what they should drink, whether something's healthy. I mean, do you get tired of hearing those questions all the time?

Julia Zumpano:

Well, I really do love what I do, so I love providing health information and providing those answers to those typical questions. Some of them, the only times it's gets tiring is when there's a lot of marketing around something that may not be healthy, and I just don't like when it takes over the system and we try to, marketing takes over nutrition and health information. So, I guess that's the only time it can be tedious.

John Horton:

Well, and that's a perfect transition into what we're talking about today. Because obviously, marketing has made kombucha kind of a big thing right now. So, as we get into that, let's just look at the basics. Can you tell us what kombucha tea is?

Julia Zumpano:

Sure. So, kombucha is thought to originate in China or Japan. It's pretty much when you take greener black tea and you add specific strains of bacteria, yeast and sugar and allow it to ferment for about a week. During that fermentation process, there's different things that start to come up, like an acidic acid trace of alcohol and then certain gases that really lead to that carbonation.

John Horton:

And it gives it a really distinct taste in flavor, doesn't it?

Julia Zumpano:

It is more of like a sour taste, almost like a vinegary taste. Depending on how much sugar you add, it could be sweeter or less sweet based on the sugar content. But yes, very specific.

John Horton:

All right. Now one of the things that, obviously, the big claim with kombucha is just that it does all these fabulous things and that that's been part of the whole marketing spin on this product since it's grown so much. So, there's a long list of benefits. So, what about if we just kind of roll through them one by one?

Julia Zumpano:

Sure, let's do it.

John Horton:

All right let's roll. One of the big things that it says is that it can boost your metabolism. Any truth to that?

Julia Zumpano:

So, we know that green tea is actually supportive of metabolism boosting, caffeine in general can boost your metabolism. It can boost your resting metabolic rate. So, when we know that these kombucha drinks are made from either green or black tea, we certainly gain the benefits of the green tea, when it's made with green or black, when it's made with black tea, there is a lot more research on green tea and a lot more benefits that have been proven through research on green tea versus black. But either one can provide some benefit there.

John Horton:

You mentioned caffeine with it. I guess I never thought of kombucha, something that was really caffeinated. Is there much in it? Where does it fall on that coffee scale?

Julia Zumpano:

Well, it's less than coffee, so it's more on the tea side scale. So, teas average 35 to 50 milligrams of caffeine per 8-ounce cup, and coffee is closer to 150. So, you're only looking at about a third or less caffeine coffee versus tea, and kombucha would have a little less than that because you have other things that are added to it to dilute it. So, I would say it's on the lower end, 35 to 50 milligrams, about a third of the caffeine of a cup of coffee.

John Horton:

OK. So, it's not going to give you that jolt in the morning. Don't count on it.

Julia Zumpano:

Well, if you're sensitive to caffeine, it certainly can. So, if you're one that doesn't drink any caffeine at all, you may actually get a little jolt from it. So, it could certainly add some benefit there.

John Horton:

Let's move on to the next one: Weight loss, which I know is something everybody's looking for, that magic, the magic trigger for that. Can kombucha make you lose a couple pounds?

Julia Zumpano:

I would say that that's a very tricky question. There have been some studies that show again that green tea can boost your metabolism, and that's kind of how it supports weight loss. But we really, weight loss is a very hairy subject. There are so many things that go into weight loss. If you're not changing your exercise routine, your diet routine at all, and you're just drinking a bottle of kombucha, I wouldn't expect to see any weight loss. But if you decide to maybe use kombucha as a health trend for yourself, and you've decided to work out three days a week and really clean up your diet, I think that can be supportive towards your goal. But on its own, I don't think that there's much truth to it causing weight loss alone.

John Horton:

Well, and I'm going to assume it's also one of those things if you substitute it in for something else, you're drinking, if you're a soda drinker and you drop in kind of unsweetened kombucha, it may help just with the reduction in calories.

Julia Zumpano:

Absolutely. All kombuchas are a little bit sweetened because it is part of the fermentation process. Some are more sweetened than others, so you would want to choose one that has a lower amount of sugar than higher. But I do recommend kombucha to some of my patients who do tend to drink soda or drink flavored sweetened carbonated drinks. So, that can be a nice way to reduce calories and then gain a lot of nutritional benefits from the swap there, too.

John Horton:

I love where this is going. A ton of great information is coming out. So, now we're moving onto another thing that you see on these bottles is that it's going to help your gut health, which is a really popular thing to say nowadays. What do they mean when they say it?

Julia Zumpano:

So, that it can certainly do during the fermentation process, it does build bacteria. So, we have bacteria in our gut, and this kombucha provides healthy gut bacteria, so it feeds your healthy bacteria in your gut, and it gives them something to grow on and feed and increase. So, we want good bacteria, we want more good bacteria than bad bacteria in our guts. And that in it of itself has been shown to have positive benefits on weight and metabolism and overall, just health and longevity. So, we really do want to look at our gut health, and that's where kombucha can really, really help is increasing those good healthy gut bacteria.

John Horton:

I feel like the word that always comes up there, people talk about, probiotics. I mean is kombucha, is it loaded with those?

Julia Zumpano:

It is considered a probiotic, and that's a food that would contain some of those healthy bacteria. Yogurt or kefir is as well, kimchi, sauerkraut, pickled vegetables, anything that goes through that fermentation process, apple cider vinegar, those are all sources of probiotics that will help stimulate that healthy growth of that bacteria.

John Horton:

Oh, that sounds like a whole episode. We could have a talk with you about those. So, we'll have to add that to our list.

Julia Zumpano:

Yes.

John Horton:

Moving on. There's also claims that kombucha can help reduce inflammation, that has antioxidants. Is that true?

Julia Zumpano:

Yes, there are antioxidants in kombucha. There are a ton of antioxidants in green tea. So, that's where you gain a lot of those, and that has been shown to suppress inflammation. So, those inflammatory processes are suppressed with the whole slew and variety of antioxidants and polyphenols that are contained in the tea and in the fermentation in kombucha.

John Horton:

Now, should people rely on that much, though? Because, I mean, I take it can help a little bit, but it's not a substitute for medicine.

Julia Zumpano:

No, but I do think inflammation should be looked at as a holistic approach, just like weight loss. So, drinking kombucha alone is not going to suppress your entire body's inflammation, but if you combine kombucha with an anti-inflammatory diet and you're using other herbs like cumin and garlic and cayenne that can support the suppression of inflammation, it's only going to help and work even further. So, it's a whole-picture approach, not individual.

John Horton:

Well, and I think that goes right into our next one, which is whether kombucha can help strengthen your immune system, will it?

Julia Zumpano:

Well, so there's a lot of different things that can strengthen your immune system, but following a healthier diet, adequate sleep, high intake of antioxidants and polyphenols, which we know has that healthy gut bacterium, that all helps support a healthy immune system. So, it does kind of go into the big picture of the immune system and has little parts that it plays to help support that.

John Horton:

Yeah, because I've also seen some claims where they say that kombucha can be even a cancer fighter. I mean, is that something that fits in there?

Julia Zumpano:

Yeah, so kombucha has antioxidants, and antioxidants protect us from being damaged. So, cell damage can lead to cancer and other diseases. So, we want to protect ourselves as much as possible. The more our cells we protect, the less damage we have, the less likely we are to have developing cancer growth tumors and other health concerns and issues. So, yes, and a high level of antioxidants can really help suppress the risk of cancer. And antioxidants can be found, of course, in kombucha green tea, but it's also found in adequate amounts of fruits and vegetables and healthy oils, so herbs and seasoning. So, it's found in a variety of foods. So again, it's a whole picture. If you can follow that high antioxidant rich diet along with having kombucha, you're only going to boost the benefit there.

John Horton:

It's amazing how many things in your life and with your health can be better if all you do is just eat a little healthier.

Julia Zumpano:

It's so true because you talk about so many things that are helpful to suppress inflammation, but really, we want to cut out the things that cause inflammation that we know is causing inflammation in our body. And we know sugar leads to inflammation like any table sugar or sweetened drinks or jams or jellies or syrups or bakery items or sweet dessert foods, ice cream, all of those things that are pretty much the foundation of the standard American diet. We know those are very inflammatory. High levels of processed fats and oils are very inflammatory. So, processed meats, processed oils, processed foods, fried foods, spread foods, all of those snack foods can lead to high amounts of inflammation. So, we can't expect to drink a kombucha and eat all those ingredients and have these benefits because we won't get them.

John Horton:

It's not going to erase your bad decisions.

Julia Zumpano:

Yes, exactly. Exactly.

John Horton:

All right. So, this next one is an area that I know is really a big one for you, and that's whether kombucha helps with heart health.

Julia Zumpano:

Yes. So, kombucha has been shown to help with heart health. There's been studies that show that green tea specifically can protect LDL from oxidation, which oxidation is kind of what activates and makes that LDL bad. It can be more likely to build plaque and create plaque building and fill up the lining of the arteries there. And that's what we really want to prevent.

John Horton:

OK. LDL is the lousy cholesterol. That's why there's the L in the front, right?

Julia Zumpano:

Yes, bad cholesterol, absolutely.

John Horton:

I also heard that it has some detox properties, which could help with your liver. Any truth to that?

Julia Zumpano:

Yeah, so we know that detoxifying the liver is extremely important and it creates less, obviously, toxins and what are those? I mean, everyone’s exposed to so many toxins and our body's ability to get rid of those will help our body work at its best ability work at prevent things like cancer and gut disorders and skin disorders and diabetes and all those things that lead to those bad negative health outcomes. So, there have been some studies that show that green tea and probiotics and those things can help support a healthy liver and detoxification, kind of pull some of that, those toxins out.

John Horton:

What about blood pressure? That's another claim that comes up with kombucha a lot. Will it help that go down?

Julia Zumpano:

It certainly can. Again, it's a whole picture. I haven't heard a ton of claims with blood pressure, but I'm sure that there's probably some backend benefit from the antioxidants and the polyphenols that can certainly lead to the vasodilation of your blood vessels that could probably help there, too.

John Horton:

All right. Now I think they just tie everything into these feel-good sorts of drinks, and this goes in, that kind of fits in there. And the last one is definitely in that realm, which there's claims that it is a mood booster. Can it just make you happier?

Julia Zumpano:

So, there have been studies that show that moderate levels of caffeine can improve mood and boost your mood. And green tea specifically has been shown, since it's so high in levels of antioxidants and polyphenols, it can also help boost mood. Good gut health can also help with boosting your mood. So, when you're having good bacteria in your gut, we really see that levels of anxiety and stress and depression go down. So, if you're drinking kombucha on a regular basis and having that feeling, that healthy gut bacteria on a daily basis or a regular basis, we really can end up seeing some of those positive benefits.

John Horton:

Well, everything you just went over, there is clearly a lot of potential awesomeness to kombucha. Is there anything in there, though, that isn't great for you? Are there any risks to drinking it that people should be aware of?

Julia Zumpano:

Sure. So, I mean, one thing is that it does have sugar in it, so we don't want to drink it without control or moderation. So, I think one bottle of kombucha a day is appropriate. Keep in mind that they range in calories, so they're about 35 to 80 calories per bottle. Some are even higher than that. So, I try to choose a lower calorie diet because all the calories are coming from sugar in this case. So, I think one would be appropriate a day to get the benefit. If you're consuming a lot of kombucha, you can have some tummy upsets, so some increased gastrointestinal symptoms that can be unpleasant. So, you want to be careful with that, too.

John Horton:

I heard, too, that there's a danger, some people make their own and that there can be some issues if you do that.

Julia Zumpano:

I mean, of course, doing anything on your own can create issues of not doing it properly and right combination of things, cleanliness, et cetera. So, if you do, you really want to be very careful, get a credible source to have the proper way of doing it. Certainly, there is nothing bad about purchasing it from the store pre-made too.

John Horton:

All right. Are there any people who should just avoid having it? I saw somewhere they were talking, if you were pregnant or have a weakened immune system, maybe you should stay away from it.

Julia Zumpano:

Pregnancy would probably only be due to the traces amount of alcohol in there. There are very trace amounts. So, even if you do a small amount 8-ounce glass of kombucha, I don't think it's going to negatively affect someone who's pregnant. It may even help with some of the uncomfortable feelings of pregnancy, like nausea.

It could actually help with an upset stomach in some cases with a depressed immune system. I mean, certainly, if you're making it yourself, I would avoid it. But if it's bottled and properly stored, I think it's also safe to have a small amount there, too. It can actually, like we said, build up your immune system.

Caffeine is something else that we want to be aware of. So, if you're sensitive to caffeine or you notice that your heart races or things like that, then you want to be cautious about the caffeine. And again, alcohol, if you have any history of alcohol dependency, you want to be careful there, too, because we want to know that there is a small trace amount of alcohol in there.

John Horton:

And I'm guessing that this goes to the claim that we put with everything, where if you are somewhat compromised or have a health issue going on, talk to your doctor or healthcare provider before adding something like this in.

Julia Zumpano:

Absolutely. That's a very individual answer. So, you really do want to seek medical advice there.

John Horton:

We always do. If you have questions, ask them. It seems to be the general rule of thumb.

Julia Zumpano:

Absolutely.

John Horton:

You mentioned the alcohol in it, and I know kombucha, there's actually a trend towards having more alcoholic kombucha drinks. People are always hoping to get their alcohol and health benefits. Are you going to get all that out of this, or is it just basically a cocktail at that point?

Julia Zumpano:

Well, you can get the benefits of kombucha because it is through, still fermented. You still get the probiotics, but you're adding the alcohol component, which is not going to help your liver, so it's not going to support that healthy liver. You're just adding more for it to detoxify. And then, anytime people drink, they tend to make less advised choices when it comes to their eating habits. So, we want to keep that in mind. But if you are normally having a happy hour beer every Friday afternoon then or evening, and you decided to switch it with a kombucha, there's certain benefits there. If you're binge-drinking on kombucha, we're not necessarily gaining a ton of benefits. But if you're swapping out one, maybe unhealthy choice for a healthier one, there certainly can be benefits there.

John Horton:

Less advised choices were a very delicate way to get around a lot of the bad issues that come with alcohol. So, kudos on that. So, bottom line with kombucha, is this something worth trying for people?

Julia Zumpano:

Absolutely think it's worth trying, yes. We've talked about a lot of benefits. Again, there's no huge medical journals that are raving about this kombucha, and there's not a lot of medical clinical studies that are show all these benefits. A lot of these can be more observational. Certainly, there is some research that supports the benefits of green tea and probiotics. We're kind of just plugging them into kombucha. But there's really no harm, especially when you're replacing maybe a sweetened beverage or something not so nutritionally dense with kombucha. I think there's certainly, it's worth trying and seeing how your body reacts to it and seeing if it helps your digestion, if you feel any better, if you are maybe even more inclined to change your diet to improve it a little bit. So, there's certainly benefits and certainly worth trying it.

John Horton:

Well, that sounds like great advice. Anything else that we missed or that you'd like to add in?

Julia Zumpano:

No, no. Just enjoy and keep the sugar content low.

John Horton:

A great tip as always. Thank you again for being here, Julia, and I look forward to having you back.

Julia Zumpano:

Thank you so much for having me.

John Horton:

There's obviously a lot of hype around kombucha and some evidence it may offer health benefits. It's worth a try, but don't expect it to work miracles. Until next time, be well.

Speaker 3:

Thank you for listening to Health Essentials, brought to you by Cleveland Clinic and Cleveland Clinic Children's. To make sure you never miss an episode, subscribe wherever you get your podcasts, or visit clevelandclinic.org/hepodcast. This podcast is for informational purposes only and is not intended to replace the advice of your own physician.